Assembling a self-rescue kit for a firefighter....need expert opinion
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| Zdenko.Mlakar19. 10. 2015 21:01:18 |
Hello!
I'm assembling a self-rescue kit for a firefighter. What does that mean? It means I'm putting together a kit that the firefighter will always carry in his pocket. In case he gets trapped in a higher floor and there's absolutely no other way to save himself, he'll descend two, maximum three floors lower with the help of this kit.
There's not much space in the side pocket on pants.
What do we need:
1. RESCUE HARNESS (infinite loop 4m circumference TUBULAR 26mm with which you make a seat harness)
2. ROPE 15m long, 6mm thick (no space for thicker rope)
3. DESCENDING DEVICE (figure eight for thin rope 5-7mm)
5. CARABINERS (climbing ones without locking for quick clipping)
6. ANCHOR HOOK (in case there's no other anchor - looking for what to use)
Why assemble it myself? Because such a kit costs about 400 euros.
For better idea of what I mean, attaching a link to this product.
http://www.petzl.com/en/Professional/Descenders/EXO?l=INT#.ViU5INLhAdU
What static 6mm rope do you recommend?
I was thinking of using the following:
POLYESTER ARAMID rope conditionally heat resistant:
http://www.kanirope.de/index.php/cat/c258_--aus-Polyester---Aramid.html/XTCsid/a4558bc5633233ffacb8fdf79bf28c9b
and
FIGURE EIGHT FOR 5-7mm ROPE
http://www.kanirope.de/product_info.php/info/p1775_Abseilachter-MICRO-FIG-EIGHT-von-ISC.html
Manufacturer says this rope has no EN standard for self-rescue, but I don't need EN standard if they claim the rope holds 1000kg.
This is about bare survival, nothing more, nothing less. And we all know a 6mm rope is enough to hold one person. We even hung three on such a rope and it didn't break.
During training it would be used with mandatory additional protection.
I wouldn't sell the kit in any way, making it just for myself.
What do you recommend, which rope to use, what to watch out for when choosing rope.
Thin rope is extremely hard to hold in hand. If there's not enough friction, I'll have to use some prusik...
I know that with such thin ropes no one guarantees anything, but I'M LOOKING FOR THE BEST OPTION I HAVE and hope we find it together.
Thanks and best regards
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| grega_z_brega19. 10. 2015 21:32:52 |
hmmm for flash hook maybe find some metalworker to cut it for you from suitable material on cnc, laser, waterjet...
various alu alloys at al-cu in Kamnik, smaller offcuts sold at lower prices/kg
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| jani bele20. 10. 2015 10:15:32 |
You say it's about bare survival here. Well, when it's really about bare survival, you'd give more than just 400€ for good gear.
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| vandica120. 10. 2015 11:26:54 |
I'm really interested in that kit you say:
"That means I'm assembling a kit that the firefighter will always have with him in his pocket." Since I go to the mountains and have to carry all the "stuff" in my backpack, this "pocket" one really interests me.  
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| GregorC20. 10. 2015 14:00:59 |
The best option you have and that we can find together is buying such a kit. If you search the net a bit, you can get cheaper ones, then there's also buying through the association (assuming you're in some volunteer fire dept). If nothing else, the thing is at least tested and certified with various certificates. .
I'm not saying it wouldn't be ok if you make it yourself, besides everything, the question is also if you'd come out cheaper (material, work, time...).
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| Zdenko.Mlakar23. 11. 2015 21:00:45 |
Hello!
Thanks for your help, and thanks also to those who just wrote a sentence.
I assembled the kit (heat-resistant rope with aramid core), thoroughly tested it (various anchors, descent from balcony, window, roof) and put it into personal use.
Vandica1 since you were interested in this "pocket" thing, attaching pictures of how it looks. I always carry the system with me...SEAT HARNESS, ANCHOR, ROPE, CONTROLLED DESCENT DEVICE. All that in two side pockets on pants. It could fit in one, but I decided to put some in the other pocket for weight distribution.
Attaching link to pictures:
https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0BwV_-g_2j49yVWpNTkxPNldqR0k&usp=sharing
Best regards
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| grega_z_brega23. 11. 2015 21:17:18 |
Well, now you have it...
How much did the whole thing cost you?
p.s. my wife has the same weight 
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| viharnik23. 11. 2015 21:41:52 |
A 6 mm rope would be, in my opinion, too jerky for any cca 100 kg tensile load in the dynamic. You have to count on sharp edges when descending through a window or even broken glass, fire, roof edges. Instructor Bela didn't say it for nothing.
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| Zdenko.Mlakar23. 11. 2015 22:14:57 |
I agree regarding dynamic loads. Even the knot reduces the rope's strength quite a bit. If I had unlimited space options, I'd rather choose 11mm rope, ID for descending and Navajo harness, but unfortunately not everything fits. This solution is the most suitable for this situation and our tactics, although for this system we can say anything but that it would be safe. Sharp edges or even glass in contact with the rope would probably mean the same as throwing myself headfirst through the window without a rope. I'm not afraid the rope won't hold, nor the anchor. The biggest problem is sharp edges, I agree. You need to be most careful there.
The kit cost me 62 euros. I'm satisfied and hope I never use it except in exercises with additional protection.
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| andrej7824. 11. 2015 09:35:44 |
This is all great...but do firefighters know how to use this, assemble it, knots and such...most probably not...?don't know
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| Zdenko.Mlakar24. 11. 2015 13:47:58 |
andrej78 I agree. For most firefighters, even basic rope technique skills like knowing knots and their use are too much, let alone assembling some demanding rescue of an injured person with stretcher over an overhang etc. That's why I didn't post detailed assembly pictures of this system and its use, to prevent some layman from copying it and harming himself or others.
I have this system for myself, and don't advertise or recommend it to others. The system isn't demanding, but I would STRONGLY ADVISE AGAINST it for most firefighters, because it's extremely dangerous and requires a certain level of rope technique knowledge.
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| ljubitelj gora24. 11. 2015 14:05:05 |
Don't play around with inferior equipment and risk your own and others' lives, so that something happens to someone. All those of us who go to the mountains, climb however much and rope technique is needed for that, everything must be proper. Equipment is bought and tested, the knowledge imparted by instructors is serious and we take it very seriously too. Those who have a homemade kit at home have no idea about the risks and consequences, don't compare to old times again. If you want help, just turn to instructors, as we also go to winter courses, alpine school, to acquire knowledge, experience, learn rope technique as soon as possible and in this activity, as I already mentioned, it's a very very serious approach.
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| andrej7824. 11. 2015 16:52:07 |
Zdenko, I don't know.. whether this is ironic or if you really mean it... professional firefighters probably know, all others... don't know... I have an unresolved ao and from what I read and understood from this, I'd have some problems...
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