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| aljazek5. 09. 2009 21:50:06 |
I join the comment because I run here too and am excited. I have a slightly longer route though, excellent for building fitness and leg strength. This area isn't just good for running, but I love packing my backpack, camera and going to explore caves, pools, streams, etc.
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| vertov6. 09. 2009 00:37:39 |
That's really worthy of respect.
How did you start with mountain running? I for example walk very fast into the mountains, but to start running, I run out of steam right away.
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| velkavrh6. 09. 2009 10:12:11 |
This year my colleague and I watched live the mountain run on Grintavec. Since the winner was very fast, result 1:19:00, he overtook us even before the finish at the top. There were many spectators and we applauded him enthusiastically. There were also many younger among the competitors. From Bojan A's posts, I then figured out that he was sick just then and couldn't participate. Really a shame!
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| Bojan_A6. 09. 2009 10:39:10 |
Yes, I prepared for this race the whole season. I really regret this race.
I started completely by chance. For 2 years I ran road races (without success). Then I participated in mountain run on Vodiška planina and was absolute third. That pulled me in. Half a year later I was already in the Slovenian national team. Mountain running is an extremely demanding discipline, but the pleasure when you overcome yourself, when you stand on top. And training takes place in very beautiful surroundings.
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| m10. 09. 2009 16:23:08 |
Hello!
I really admire all who run. Especially mountain running.
Years ago I went (walked!) on that path where you run to Črno prst. I can't imagine running on it!  As Jolanda Ceplak would say: "A la ti vera."
But Bojan, how do you run with injured ankles? Don't you have any fear, e.g. when rushing over rough and steep, for your ankles?
I know if a person feared everything, they'd stay home, but... Aren't you afraid of re-injuries?
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| Bojan_A10. 09. 2009 17:08:07 |
Hi
Run on Črno prst isn't the hardest, because it's not that steep. On 6 km the path climbs 1300 m. So over 200 m elevation per km, which is almost ideal for mountain running.
I extremely fear ankle injuries. In my life I've twisted both together over 50 times. They keep twisting. So many twists that I made a five-level scale. 
First degree twist is everyday and doesn't bother me, second degree heals in one day. Third degree means 3 days rest (usually once every two months). Fourth degree one week on crutches (few times a year). Fifth degree I had only once and means plaster.
Because of these issues I only run one of the three mountain running disciplines - uphill running. Downhill running always ends with twisted ankle for me. So usually for descent I need twice as long as for ascent.
Fear of ankle twist is always there and means I watch the weak spot. But even that doesn't help, because you can't be 100% concentrated all day. Today I twisted my ankle second degree (luckily!) 2 min run from the car.
Luckily uphill running rarely twists my ankle.
There are also some runners with such strong ligaments in ankle that even if twisted hard, it won't swell. Those can compete in the other two disciplines: up-down run and mountain (ultra)marathon. Me, even the smallest descent, even flat scares me.
On Mountain marathon of four municipalities there's 16 km descent from Črne prsti to Huda Južina. Some are specialists for such sections. Especially competitive ski mountaineers. The best descend at speed at least 3000 m/h. How extremely fast one can descend the guys proved on Kališče. For 830 m descent they needed 10.5 min, which is average descent speed 4700 m/h.
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| furioso10. 09. 2009 21:19:10 |
Hi,
these your pics and numbers are really praiseworthy,...
Personally I hike a lot in hills. Lately also run sometimes. Besides that I also do road cycling.
Question: what heart rate do you have uphill running say at easy, medium and steep incline? Do you run non-stop or on steeper inclines prefer fast walking?
My personal record so far 1120 elev m/h. How much can you climb in 1h.
Thanks for answers and rich info.
Good luck ahead, especially downhill,..
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| Bojan_A10. 09. 2009 23:27:02 |
Hi
I don't have a watch or pulse meter so I don't know how high my pulse is. Probably on race always at least 95%. Only on Črni prsti I didn't run full out. If you look at those race pics, you'll see I'm on the edge of collapse in all. I don't even recognize myself. Effort is so great muscles start shaking, then you're not even hot anymore, but start shivering even in heat. At this level I'm not far from collapse and must reach finish in max 5 min. Once I measured resting pulse and it was under 40.
As for technique. If incline is really steep, with fast walking and long steps you're almost faster than running (called knee biting technique). Running uses huge energy, e.g. running stairs is extremely tiring because you have to "jump" high.
Technique varies from person to person. Simon Alič is known for running where no one can. On extreme steep he's practically unbeatable, as his many track records show. Mitja Kosovelj is a real runner, athlete, excellent on gentler slopes and downhill, where he's a class better than all ours and thus by far the best Slovenian mountain runner.
Would be interesting to organize a vertical gain race here too. In Italy someone ran 1000 m in less than half hour! 1120 m/h is excellent - most can't do that. With this you're ready for races.
On races average ascent speed data often irrelevant, because almost no race without downhill, flat..
On Črni prsti for ca. 1300 elev I needed under 56 min, that's 1400 m/h. Quite average after all.cool
Most races except Grintovec last under one hour anyway.
Best and hope to see you soon at some race,
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| miham11. 09. 2009 09:46:10 |
Hi,
I'm interested in how your trainings go. How much time per day do you train, how many times per week and with what intensity?
And also this. Maybe you know where the mountain run track on Krim goes?
Thanks for the answers and best regards,
Miha
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| Bojan_A11. 09. 2009 11:04:01 |
Hi
I train purely depending on free time and mountain conditions. In winter school takes a huge amount of time and simply I have no time to train in the hills during the week. So I do intervals and hill sprints. I'm from Gorenjska and don't lack road hills. Most important is speed - without it no go - so I run lots of fartlek, where I run short time at 20 km/h, then some 100 m 15 km/h and accelerate to 3 min/km pace. I repeat that usually around 6 km, because I can't hold longer (except preparing for road marathon). On weekends or holidays if nice weather and no snow I run in mountains. I aim for at least 1000m elevation gain. I choose mostly Karavanke because no long drive. When training always max intensity, because slow runs don't build form. Always run fast. I do regeneration trainings only occasionally after races or hard trainings. E.g. morning run to Stol, evening 10 km slow run for pure pleasure.nasmeh I like to run somewhere different each time so not boring.
Here comes my question. Your suggestions where else in Karavanke to run (besides Kepa, Golica, Stol, Vrtača, Košuta, Begunjščica)? Can be smart shortcuts or combinations of several peaks. Thanks!
I run average 5 times per week. Road trainings take usually one hour. Mountain ones can half day, since on top in one hour, latest two. Descent usually drags. Like to photo and enjoy.
Run on Krim? zmeden Honestly first time hearing about it.
Best, Bojan
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| BT8811. 09. 2009 11:32:24 |
Yeah, pretty good times, bravo and you also need quite a bit of toughness.
I have a question about running shoes that you wear on the last run to Črna Prst; I also saw LA SPORTIVA CROSSLITE. Basically I need new shoes for mountain running. Bojan, thanks for the answer.
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| GITA11. 09. 2009 11:40:50 |
Hi Bojan,
after reading your posts and looking at the pictures I realized you're the one my husband and I met on Storžič end of June this year...you probably remember, total fog and cold... , back then it was totally incomprehensible to me that someone can run on Storžič...well, now that I read you things are becoming clearer
Regarding your question where else you could run in Karavanke - I have no experience with mountain running but we were last fall late on Dovška Baba and in my opinion it would be a good trail for mountain running. We went from Raven but I see if you go from Dovje you get about 1000m elevation. Well I don't know, check if it seems suitable to you. Good luck and much success further!
http://www.hribi.net/gora/dovska_baba/11/275
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| Bojan_A11. 09. 2009 12:17:03 |
Hello
@ BT88: I have the same problem. I urgently need new shoes and inquired about Crosslite. They say good grip in rain and uphill running. But downhill they are bad and apparently slip a lot, ankle twists easily in them. And 100g heavier than competing Inov-8 models. But quite cheap - "only" 90 €. But I'll probably stick with Inov-8 because it's proven excellent shoe. Probably get featherlight Inov-8 X-talon 212 or again Mudroc 280. Unfortunately this year's model of these shoes is worse than last year's. So in my opinion X-talon is the best shoe for mountain running currently on the market. Drawback of Inov-8 models compared to Crosslite is they have absolutely no cushioning while Crosslite has a little.
A bit more about shoes: http://bojanambrozic.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!ACD975034630F7FE!7211.entry
@ GITA Yes, I remember. This year I was six times on Storžič and only once no fog, wind and cold. But I think we met on July 1st if I have training recorded correctly. Then I last time this year ran via Kališče.
Dovška Baba combined with Kepa would be great.
Thanks and best regards, Bojan
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| BT8811. 09. 2009 12:25:48 |
Bojan A Thanks for the answer. Where can one buy those Inov-8? I saw that you have them at that bolš but haven't spotted them in any well-stocked shop yet. And if you maybe know approx how many € to pay.
Best regards. And as few twisted ankles as possible. Thanks
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| Bojan_A11. 09. 2009 12:32:23 |
Most of the national team uses Inov-8 shoes. Only sometimes, when very dry, no need and best they wear so-called racers to run faster because with Inov-8 on asphalt or even good macadam no way. For dirty terrain though in my opinion nothing better.
Inov-8 gear available in biathlete Tadeja Brankovič shop at Planina in Kranj: http://tadejabrankovic.si/trgovina.html?page=shop.browse&category_id=8
And tell them I did the "advertising"
Best regards, Bojan
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| GITA11. 09. 2009 12:48:28 |
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| Bojan_A11. 09. 2009 13:02:51 |
Yes, also on July 6th I was there - then really with Povelj. I think around 1 pm thunderstorm and we just fled from the climbing area in Preddvor.
Interesting suggestion: -Trupejevo poldne because in summer I haven't been yet - only in winter.
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| geppo11. 09. 2009 16:07:11 |
But I'm glad I encouraged (judging by the response) this topic that I missed on this forum. So Tadej can already think about opening an option - let him give the name himself if he agrees!!
Regards
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