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| lakkon19. 08. 2015 00:04:28 |
julika... biggest thanks for the answer, which was the only one to touch exactly my dilemma
JusAvgustin... thanks for the suggestion. but if I just look at the times on hribi.net needed for Prisojnik alone, your path to it is time-wise quite longer. and I don't intend to go exactly on Hanzova path this year, if that's what was meant. well, Prisojnik-Razor is the same path as ''mine'', descent to 3rd serpentine from Razor is probably also quite longer than my choice. breaks cca 30min on Prisojnik and also Razor - of course depending on weather - photography, some chat with hikers, that adds extra time. I'll rather stick to my shorter idea from one of the serpentines 29 or 32. Doing the real climbing on Prisojnik + all the rest would be too much for me in one day. Sometime in the future maybe.
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| pikica119. 08. 2015 08:26:46 |
Lately I don't understand you at all anymore. If in one day you don't step on at least a couple of peaks you consider yourselves just Sunday strollers, or am I wrong. Both Prisank and Razor are giants, why should a hiker cram them into one day. Even if condition and speed are at peak, why rush so much. You go at a lively pace, enjoy the views with the company you have, take photos, in short have fun. At the top you treat yourself to a rest as befits such awesome peaks. If the pace is more moderate there's less chance of injury or otherwise getting into trouble. Of course that's why we go to the mountains, to see something and have fun. Time only chases us up there if the weather turns bad and night approaches, otherwise up there it's freedom 
For runners mountains are a polygon, for hikers relaxation and opportunity for nice memories of mountain experiences.
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| JusAvgustin19. 08. 2015 09:08:24 |
There was already a hot debate on this topic, no need to pour oil... As I wrote, times are just informational and don't reflect actual timetable. Someone will take 3 days for the tour, someone 10 hours. Who cares about time. Everyone according to their abilities. For info, when I did the tour the pace was far from running... 
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| lakkon19. 08. 2015 12:09:45 |
pikica1... I agree. This should especially apply to those: who go for the first time on exactly specified all-day tour + which includes also more demanding parts of the path + who like to stop here and there and admire the view + photograph + maybe talk to someone. As far as I'm concerned, in such cases all stated applies and Prisojnik+Razor wouldn't be an exception. But of course still considering that I need to hurry a bit. If there was already a time crisis, I'd speed up on the return on less demanding parts, which I'd also mostly know from the ascent. Probably at the end, maybe also at the start of the tour with headlamp For me fitness and knowledge are no problem. I just added up times from-to some point and came to the conclusion it would be doable. Myself I'll probably have total 1h break on both mountains.
JusAvgustin... although I'm more a supporter of what I mentioned a bit earlier, on the other hand I understand you too. But I think my suggestion is at least for now more suitable for me. Maybe also from Vršič, as some suggest. And at your link it says below: ''Times are merely informative and do not count breaks on the way, which will surely happen.'' and the only comment says something too.
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| pikica119. 08. 2015 13:36:35 |
@JusAvgustin my post wasn't meant as provocation. It seems stupid to me, because people get lured so quickly and start racing themselves. And what happens then, somewhere first time and doesn't even take that much time to calmly look from the top where what is. Anyway the main thing is that we know where we go and how we go. Me, if somewhere first time I look a bit at people on top and if I spot a "local" I just ask him a bit if he can tell me the peaks around. Don't care if someone nearby rolls eyes, if I don't know some peak when I'll go third time up I'll know more already.
Everyone should know where they fit. Both the one asking and the one giving advice. When mountain runner writes, yeah step a bit faster and you can hike all from Škrlatica to Triglav and all in between. That he can say only among equals. And Hanzova to Prisank, is quite a mouthful for skilled hiker and descent via one of the other paths offered at top. Ordinary hiker can have "flat ears" from excitement for whole week after hiking it once, well at least I was  I felt a bit important  For someone who considers himself alpinist or even is, it's "small stuff".
You all often forget who the forum is for, and I have nothing against runners or those for whom air under ass doesn't bother too much. Would be nice if you try to understand a bit also our mountain visits. It makes my hair stand on end when I read some post what kind of hikers some are, why go to mountains if they barely move on path. That the wound-up and sporty gentleman has to wait and overtake, how much time and power it takes him. Madonna, Ferrari will overtake a bug anyway.
@lakkon for mountains and nice views you need to take time, like for friends too. Don't cut too big piece of bread, you need to know to enjoy also in smaller portions
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| GregorC19. 08. 2015 14:11:37 |
But I think the forum is intended for ALL mountain visitors, as shown by the different categories under the conditions forum. And it's time to start respect among all instead of putting sticks under one's feet and looking down on others. We are just different. Some enjoy a slower pace, views, photographing, flowers, etc. Others enjoy running over peaks and competing with time. And I'm sure at the end of the tour both are satisfied and have taken a lot from the mountain visit. During the tour, a greeting and smile to the one you meet and on we go.
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| LidijaJesih19. 08. 2015 14:31:32 |
Let me add my opinion to the original question; I don't know if there's any significant difference in the described route between one or the other starting point. The one at the 29th serpentine is lower, and on the return you have to walk back up a bit less, but you have to do it at the start. It seems to me that apart from a few tens of meters of elevation there's no special difference. The path past Kranjska planina to the junction with the marked path is also a bit more demanding for orientation, it takes a good hour to the junction, that's it. The times on hribi.net hold for an average hiker. Also need to consider that Jubilejna on descent is no shorter than on ascent, as it requires caution. If I've helped right, good, if not that's fine too.
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| ms_primoz19. 08. 2015 14:45:30 |
pikica1 - poking the hornet's nest again. Wait till he gets back from the Himalayas and tells you his own
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| Domch19. 08. 2015 15:05:07 |
This year Hanzova is dry, which isn't every year, so it would be worth taking advantage to finally get an answer which is more demanding - Kopiščarjeva or Hanzova?
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| pikica119. 08. 2015 15:09:56 |
Eh nothing bad he'll just return, send me to the stable and that's it, or send me for a crotch check, cause last time he was figuring out if I'm her or him but shhh I'm quiet already
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| ljubitelj gora19. 08. 2015 17:14:17 |
Kopiščarjeva is a bit harder than Hanzova. It doesn't pay to go to Prisank and Razor in one day. Because when you're at sedlo Mlinarica you only then see how much is left to cross. We for example used the whole day just for Kopiščarjeva and Jubilejna, with lots of photos and stops.
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| dprapr19. 08. 2015 17:37:48 |
One section on Kopiščarjeva (below the chimney) is definitely harder than any on Hanzova. Overall, especially if there are snowfields, Hanzova is more demanding. Also because of the unprotected section in the upper part.
How much someone covers in one day is entirely their business. Whether they enjoy it or not. I think no one goes up there to not enjoy it. Slowly or fast, however.
In youth we're faster, in "maturity" everything goes with more thoughtfully measured steps.
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| Domch19. 08. 2015 19:35:00 |
Well written and described, judging by the photos I agree with you. In mountaineering books and guides it's written that Kopiščarjeva is harder than Hanzova (marked as the most demanding secured mountain path in our mountains). I've done Kopiščarjeva myself, but not Hanzova or Jubilejna yet. Judging by the photos on this forum both look more demanding than Kopiščarjeva, but the most reliable is when you've done them all. For Kopiščarjeva I can say it's very interesting and nicely secured. Key parts are the chimney and exit from it, and the section to the window and ascent to its top.
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| ms_primoz19. 08. 2015 19:37:11 |
domch - we can go check one and the other if you have time sometime I'm up for it
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| pikica119. 08. 2015 19:48:16 |
I have Mihelič's guide and it says: Hanzova is without doubt the most serious and wild secured path in Slovenian mountains.
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| Domch19. 08. 2015 19:48:27 |
Hanzova soon on the schedule, because no snow this year and worth taking advantage. Jubilejna will also need to be tried, even if it looks scary, we'll shake a bit
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| lepenatka19. 08. 2015 19:59:38 |
I think the difficulty is relative depending on experience. On Thursday I walked Kopiščarjevo, and it didn't seem difficult to me. The path was dry, which is also important, and no crowds and no loose rocks. Hanzova is still waiting for me.
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| IgorZlodej19. 08. 2015 20:03:12 |
Once I went from Koča na Gozdu via Hanzova to Prisank and via Jubilejna through Zadnje okno to Mlinarica and to the saddle between Planja and Razor, and down to Kriške pode for a beer. There I debated a bit with warden Simon (older ones surely remember him, now I think he's the boss at the club), then I went to Pihavec and down to Luknja and Čez Plemenice to Triglav and down to Kredarica. 9 and a half hours, and I wasn't rushing at all, but I was about 20 years younger . Back then you descended from Zadnje okno still via the gully, now the path goes over the wall.
The path's difficulty isn't measured only by more difficult sections and other details, but also by length, so definitely Hanzova is the hardest.
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