Loerst - Recent messages

Hello everyone,

yesterday when I went for a short walk in the forest I "collected" three ticks on myself in just one hour. It made me think...

What do you think, does it make sense to get vaccinated against tick-borne diseases? Apparently especially Gorenjska ticks are among the most infectious in Europe. High mountains are not dangerous, the problem is walking in forests.

Idea was to see closer side ridge of Karavanke from Kopišče, over Srednji vrh to White Walls (Beautiful Peak). Project turned more time-consuming than first looked, but probably partly my fault, didn't always hit direction best, result more bushwhacking than probably needed. Well, happens.

Park before hunter hut Železnica, real winter conditions there, while south slopes just lovely sun. But what, I don't go there. Ridge start at Kopišče, leads less visible but nice path, summit trimmed, offers great views. Further along ridge to Srednji vrh I sense path, but not sure.. hunter or animal? When it turns somewhere into three nice directs over rock step I get answer and go my way as I know. Somewhere near top hit trimmed scrub and path again, at Srednji vrh surprised by box with logbook. Maybe not so rarely visited after all? Though entries just one page in two years... Path ahead over whole ridge, but locally quite overgrown and when turns north into snow lost it a few times. A couple spots short detours around rock steps, no tech difficulty, just time-consuming.

Finally arrive at Beautiful Peak (aka White Walls), splendid viewpoint. Since started late and thrashed too long, days short, shortened plan and leave Trupejevo poldne for another time and road march to car and finish.

Plešivec is technically easy summit and if the idea is to stick to the path, orientation at least in good weather shouldn't pose any special problems. But quite some elevation gain accumulates.

I park below at Soča, then up the mulattiera. It really is long (ca 8 km to hunting hut), but very fast and comfortable, so doesn't take too much energy.

From the hut upwards leads a solidly trodden path, on which faded remnants of markings are still locally visible. Somewhere in between the path forks and instead left (Trentski Pelc) I turn sharply right (Plešivec). Where the path loses in grass, numerous cairns help me, so I repair them on the way and add a stone to each.

Views from the top are very nice, but soon it starts to get cold up there, so I turn back quickly and down the same path. On the way I hop to the top of Glava and stroll to planina Berebica (sometimes Verevica or Veverica too), then it's already late enough that it's time to head down.

@Trobec First, apology for the (very) late reply. In the last few weeks I wasn't master of my time, and on the forum the topic quickly sinks into the depths.

The data on MaPZS (are still) not based on Lidar. PZS does have all the data, including Lidar processing, but it hasn't made it to the maps yet because it's not that simple. It will, sooner or later. PlanGIS (internal version of MaPZS) already has Lidar heights and saddles as one of the layers. The difference between MaPZS and individual maps is that they come from different sources, so they differ from each other. Even "official heights" are in places decades old, measured with the technology available at the time, according to the standards then in force. And since in many cases it's hard-to-reach points (not necessarily technically difficult, but more in the sense that it's hard to drag a theodolite through the Alps, not to mention the motivation for such an act ) no one ever felt the need to check them.

Lidar heights often differ from OpenTopo and similar maps. Off the cuff, I'd say only about half of the heights are correct, and another 30% are in the +-1 m range, which let's say is about the same.

Or put differently, every fifth peak has noticeably wrong data on the maps. There are 4 types of errors:

- height doesn't match (mostly by a couple m, but there are cases with dozens of m difference)
- location doesn't match (official peaks often not at the highest point)
- peak exists in nature but not on any map (especially in mid-mountains, i.e. on Snežniška Planota, in Kočevski Rog... full of such cases)
- peak on the map but doesn't exist in reality (viewpoints, ends of ridges, geographical names of some area that actually isn't a peak etc.)

@lijaneja Vrh Nakla is a typical such example. It's a contour line with exactly 2000 m height and only 14 m above saddle and marked as peak on many maps. Lies right by the marked path on Rombon and ascent takes a minute. But somehow it ended up on all lists and since it sounds cooler to conquer e.g. 5 peaks in one trip instead of just one, it persists there.

@Dvas Tell me what a peak is and I'll tell you how many and which ones there are.

Since there's no definition of what a peak is, there's no easy answer to that question. M&M are kings, but when making the list they could only rely on the maps available to them and those had and still have a bunch of errors. Also, just because a contour line is named doesn't mean it's a peak and vice versa - if something on the map has no name, it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Recently all of Slovenia was scanned with LIDAR technique with accuracy +- 15 cm, so the data is available today, but it hasn't made it to the maps yet because that process is unfortunately very slow.

If I ever find the time, I might make a complete (coherent and verified) list for the joy of peak collectors or maybe I'll manage to convince PZS to do it together. Until then, just quick info that in the Kanin area there are 7 peaks with prominence (= height above saddle) +100 m (Rombon, Velika Črnelska Špica, Lopa, Prestreljenik, Kanin, Vrh Laške Planje and Velika Baba) or if you lower the limit to prominence 30 m (which is really the minimum so not every boulder is a "peak"), there are about 30 such peaks on the Slovenian side.

Which of course in no way diminishes the pleasure and joy of wandering around Kanin, one of the most beautiful corners of our country. Just that those 5 minutes in which you casually pass Mala and Velika Ušje and Vrh Police might not count exactly as conquering three two-thousanders.

That all regular rooms at Kredarica are full until September holds true. That there's usually a whole circus there and it's worth rethinking the point of visiting in high season also.

Completely totally booked they nevertheless (yet) aren't - on common sleeping places there are still quite some free spots even in August, especially during weekdays, check the reservation system.

Coffee's photo is definitely from the Suhadolnik direction, I'm adding one to you from the path to Kokrska Kočna, just a bit higher, turned towards the ridge that leads to Na Križu.

A bit of caution is needed and it's not quite for everyone, but it's not too serious anyway.

I've wanted to visit Škrlatica for a long time, but to be honest I'm a bit worried about the fitness demands, so question - would it make sense to extend it to two days and reach Pogačnikov dom first day and then next day to Škrlatica, or is the hut already so far + some extra elevation because of that, that it would just prolong everything quite a bit, not particularly ease things?

I have a question about the path to Vrh Planj (ok, not Mangart, but nearby, so hope I'll be forgiven).

With a buddy we'd go for a walk from Mangart waterfall to Vrh Planj. And since we prefer walking in nature rather than on the road, we'd take the path as drawn on the map.

Dilemma: this path is on MaPZS map, marked "poorly trodden trail", but it's not on any other map (well, checked two more).

Question: does the path exist, is everything ok with it, or is it all overgrown? No problem for us to push through some bushes and I understand nature does its thing, but wouldn't want to bash complete 400m elevation through shrubbery.

@rokeg If you're collecting peaks, the website www.peakbagger.com might interest you. It has all 828 Slovenian peaks with prominence over 100 m (say that's the limit when something is a "peak" by all criteria), and a couple hundred other points (mostly less prominent peaks). A large part has heights verified by LIDAR (which is a special topic that could have its own discussion). There are actually 8316 peaks according to GURS, but their database is quite unreliable with many errors. But here it's all the nubs from Debelega rtiča upwards, which from the view of someone who likes hiking hills probably makes no sense.

Lists of two-thousanders are problematic for several reasons. The first was already said - people then rush to some elevation points and expose themselves beyond their abilities, even when it makes no sense. Especially because of lack of definition when a point is a peak, they are compiled arbitrarily, and so there are a bunch of side peaks, elevation points, geographic areas...

I'm looking and clicking, but somehow can't find the answer - if I arrive at Aljažev dom in the evening (e.g. 21h), sleep, next day wander around and back e.g. by 19h... is that one parking day (less than 24h) or two days (two calendar days)?

I was there Sunday, no daffodils yet, plants not even formed buds, so probably still far to bloom.

Some other kinds of flowers were there, but what they are, you'll have to find out yourself, sadly I know nothing about them.

Burned out from turbo daily grind at work and desperately needing some dear peace, on Wednesday I took a day off. Since Veliki Selišnik is relatively close and I've never been there, it seemed a suitable goal.

Start at Rudno polje, where parking was practically empty. Initial road heavily icy, later towards Viševnik the path is a packed highway. At the junction below the saddle I turn right, where apart from traces of someone with snowshoes nothing was trodden. I walk around Viševnik and occasionally see some marks, but the path is completely under snow. Past Srenjsko jezerce first to Draški rob, from it to Veliki and further to Srednji Selišnik and past Mali Selišnik off-trail a bit my own way into the valley. Due to relatively little snow the route was safe, otherwise it looked like fairly avalanche-prone slopes. I went with crampons and it was OK, but probably easier and faster with snowshoes or skis.

Darinka - first congrats on the nice trip and cool photos!

You write that "you went by another path to below Zjabci". Is that meant with the car too (but where then, since there's only one road there?) or in the sense that you just walked from Soča?

The road is in quite poor condition, but with considerable caution it's generally possible to drive it without incidents even with a regular city car, though that doesn't mean many avoid some "upgrade" to the undercarriage. Owners of higher cars (not necessarily 4x4, just taller) have a clear advantage here.

On Friday I was on Štruca and Skuta. Starting point at Suhadolnik. Sometimes some people despite the sign drove further on the forest road, but a torrent destroyed it in between, so that's no longer possible. Already at the beginning I meet a young guy coming from Kočna who says it took him 4 hours up and down. He really flew like a rocket. From Cojzova koča onwards via Mala vratca to the bivouac under Grintovec and then via Velike pode past Dolgi hrbet. On the ascent to the ridge a bit of care is needed, but overall the whole path is in good condition and excellently marked. Štruca summit is practically on the way, on Skuta quite a few of us gathered from both directions.

Long and strenuous tour - about 1,800 m of elevation gain accumulated by the end of the day - but definitely among the most beautiful in our mountains. Next time I'll go over Dolgi hrbet too.