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| Anansie1. 03. 2019 12:06:02 |
Hi, so small crampons enough for tomorrow's ascent?
LP
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| redbull1. 03. 2019 12:57:17 |
Chains/microcrampons are good for a walk on an icy road or to the neighbor's house. That's all they're useful for.
Good luck
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| 5Xum1. 03. 2019 13:51:36 |
This portal obviously has only two types of users. The first type would love to dash to Triglav in small crampons, the second would love to nail to the cross any fool who dares climb anything higher than the neighbor's manure pile in small crampons.
True, the first type is more dangerous to self, but please, some reality. Chains are perfectly OK and super useful for many ascents, esp below treeline. E.g., the path on Roblek is so trodden and safe, no need for crampons, but with chains much easier than boots alone. So please, no exaggerating either way.
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| tinky1. 03. 2019 14:12:20 |
I always carry crampons in these conditions, put them on as needed.
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| lakkon1. 03. 2019 16:23:25 |
I do it like tinky and think like 5Xum. Yesterday, e.g., the path Jasna - Vitranc - Ciprnik, which I did in the morning, I went up and down without putting them on. I went easy, smartly on the more critical parts. Same years ago Viševnik up without, down with them. I'm talking about those ordinary small Veriga Lesce. They did the job very well. Of course it's easier on descents when you know the terrain from the ascent. If your goal is speed or the terrain is such that you judge it's really not safe without them, then you obligatory put them on up. With these small ones I wouldn't set out on serious winter tours.
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| Sorok1. 03. 2019 16:26:46 |
Ouch - so-called "small" crampons have 445 types, not just "chains" 
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| dprapr1. 03. 2019 17:16:59 |
As much as I observe hikers on Pohorje, it seems "microcrampons" are suitable only for older hikers who are at greater risk from falls due to possible complicated fractures. Especially on descents.
It looks like I'm not yet among them, as I haven't bought them, though some have asked me, "you go without crampons." Usually I reply that I use crampons only for mountains.
For younger ones, in my opinion, there's nothing wrong if they "practice" a bit on icy ground, because it will come in handy for them in the high mountains.
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| Anansie1. 03. 2019 17:35:39 |
I really don't understand these responses anymore, really. I just nicely asked Mr. Tinky if he used small crampons, Veriga brand, and instead I get at least advice to wait for summer and not push into trouble...JAO. Thanks for the answers. LP
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| bongo1. 03. 2019 17:43:31 |
Given the peak height, terrain, temperatures and Tinky's photos, take small crampons with you, but I think you won't need them. I just came down from Ratitovec (1667m), where on Sunday you were killing yourself without crampons, today I didn't put them on. All melted off.
Caution on the trail is of course not amiss, Redbull's response is, even if you don't like it, completely appropriate. The problem is that Veriga crampons (mostly combined with trekking poles) and moving on snow and ice with them can give the user confidence and then they push higher with them until one day they seriously slip. Then you realize that in winter conditions only 12-point crampons, ice axe and of course knowledge are really useful, and you understand statements like redbull's.
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| jax1. 03. 2019 17:50:02 |
5Xum
1.3.2019 This portal obviously has only two types of users. The first type would love to go straight to Triglav in small crampons, the second would love to nail to the cross anyone who dares to climb anything higher than the neighbor's manure pile in small crampons.
True, the first type is more dangerous to himself, but please, a bit of reality. Small crampons are completely fine and extremely useful for many ascents, especially those below the forest line. For example, on Roblek the path is so trodden and completely safe, I see no need for crampons, on the other hand you go much easier with small crampons than just boots. So please, don't exaggerate in either direction.
Congratulations, hit the bullseye. When will some finally accept the fact that small crampons are a perfectly usable part of mountaineering gear and have their field of use. Clearly this isn't Triglav, but Roblek and Okrešelj are mountains too, right?
On dprapr's comments about "training" on icy ground, no point wasting words. That's exactly the unnecessary risk that can be nicely reduced with small crampons.
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| redbull1. 03. 2019 18:07:06 |
Regarding crampons I can only give my friend's statement, which I agree with. If you can't go to Velika Planina without crampons then you have no business in the high mountains. This is about practicing movement, as I said. Anansie take crampons and you'll assess the ascent/descent yourself
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| Bandzo1. 03. 2019 18:27:51 |
If you have neither crampons nor microcrampons with you, you can't put them on when you need them. When that moment comes where you have to decide between "big" or "small" comes with experience. Just go, take what you think. If you choose right, you'll learn something. If you choose wrong, you'll learn even more. Experiential learning is most valuable and no need to argue right away that wrong gear choice necessarily means death at the end of the day. Every mountaineer can always turn back. Be it on Šmarno or Nanga Parbat. But if you don't go, you learn nothing. Over time you gain knowledge and know that for choice (in this case crampons) the path location, slope, troddenness and snow amount matter. And in these different conditions there are different (correct) choices. Anyway, when I remember how I started discovering mountains, I cross myself  But I learned a lot from mistakes. Which is the point.
Safe steps to all,
Ben
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| tinky1. 03. 2019 18:40:41 |
Ha ha nice responses. I'll go to Dedec again!!
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| klemen911. 03. 2019 18:41:46 |
Bandzo, you hit the essence. I sign under this too.
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| darinka41. 03. 2019 18:43:20 |
Well, I read these comments, but small crampons didn't convince me, because I don't have them. Nor do I plan to buy them. It's not even hard once you get used to using 12-tooth crampons, which I trust the most. And it's nice walking in them once you get used to them.
Because they grip well when the ground is hard. Tested on the last tour.
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| dprapr1. 03. 2019 19:06:36 |
Ha, ha, jax, until you enlightened me, I didn't know what I was exposing myself to on Pohorje. I'll go shopping for microcrampons or chains tomorrow right away.
But I had the opportunity countless times in the past to observe some how "pitiful" they were in the crotch during descent after a difficult route climbed. Reminds me a bit of that "training on icy ground" they lacked. The two things are very similar.
I'm completely indifferent as to what crampons or microcrampons hikers use, as long as they don't endanger others and don't pass it on to beginners in the mountains. Which they do with forum posts!
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| Bandzo1. 03. 2019 19:25:51 |
Darinka4, if there's too little snow you're more unstable than stable in "big" crampons
Tinky: Next time together
And yes, just go again
LP,
Ben
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| ejti1. 03. 2019 20:20:38 |
I always take all three with me on winter tours. For example, yesterday when I went to Grintovec, I walked comfortably with chains up to below the saddle, where I changed into crampons and took the ice axe in hand. I've also gone to Storžič with chains when there was so little snow (half bare, half icy) that crampons would have been more like "dry tooling". So for me chains are quite useful, but clearly they can't replace winter gear on serious tours.
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| Domch1. 03. 2019 21:02:34 |
Both have their pros and cons. Micro-crampons are light, you stick them in the side pocket of your backpack, easy to put on. For trodden icy paths they are definitely better than classic ones. But for dangerous traverses and untrodden fully winter terrain with steeper slopes, they are of course not the best choice. Usually I judge from predecessors' photos if micros will suffice or not.
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