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| dragica.gnjezda@gmail.com4. 04. 2011 23:10:07 |
I agree with you hribovc88. I also wish safe steps to everyone from the heart. Good night.
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| Zebdi4. 04. 2011 23:24:04 |
Snow Leppard, yes I agree that such people somehow don't belong in the high mountains, but the problem arises when they find themselves there, in trouble and don't dare ask for help.
Regarding chains... well I don't know, I somehow can't imagine going through, say, Turski žleb in winter with them. It could be quite interesting 
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| Wine5. 04. 2011 00:44:32 |
where this discussion is going...
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| carpediem5. 04. 2011 00:59:57 |
Dragica- what Juš wanted to say with the chains is just that you shouldn't think they are "real" crampons. He was right, chains just aren't for everywhere. And don't judge others based on posts on this forum- far from arrogant.
As for stezosledka and her colleague- I hope and believe they won't go repeating that feat equipped like that. These words will probably be familiar to some: "Watch out that things don't become too easy for you.." So, wisely and prudently, and such discussions won't even be needed.. Good luck everyone 
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| dragica.gnjezda@gmail.com5. 04. 2011 12:39:07 |
it bothers me that a person shouldn't be allowed to voice their opinion. for me these crampons this year and last fall fit so well that I'm really excited. and gladly I want to share that with others so they don't fight where it's not needed. whether good or bad, I say it as it is, not that someone dares forbid it. I believe jus is a decent guy. we all make mistakes. I see jus as "coconut" (in good sense), who watches over the "chicks". for such position he should be even more careful in his statements.
and best greetings to all.
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| ljubitelj gora5. 04. 2011 13:25:01 |
Crampons up down, are needed for winter ascents as essential equipment.
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| GregorC5. 04. 2011 13:26:16 |
I believe dragica they fit you well, but these chains are meant for easier tours (like Jošt and similar) not for use in mountains, as some claimed in the other thread. By the way I have them too.
As for juš (don't know him personally) and some statements you wrote about him, I really don't understand what bothers you if he wrote a warning about what happened. His first post was completely correct and didn't offend anyone. But stezosledka attacked him instead of thanks with such arguments that one could only wonder who should be grateful to whom. So his second post was still quite mild. Although some claim otherwise. Obviously on this forum it's best to stick to writing in style very nice, bravo, congrats... God forbid ever giving a critical opinion, let alone something else. Because there are certain users here who jump up immediately when an experienced person criticizes something. And such repeat from thread to thread. If it continues like this the forum will sadly slowly die out like the one on the alpine association site. But I hope I'm wrong, because it would be a shame. Sorry for going a bit off topic.
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| Volk5. 04. 2011 14:23:56 |
The day before yesterday during a walk with my little daughter I ran into an elderly lady sitting on a bench. During the conversation she confided in me that she already carries more than nine crosses ...
That bench is in a nice quiet place on the edge of the meadow at the foot of mighty Storžič. The pleasant chat brought up quite a few gray stories from times I luckily haven't lived through. "Oh how we rejoiced at every piece of bread! Even though it was hard we could hardly wait ..."
And take care of yourselves.
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| dragica.gnjezda@gmail.com5. 04. 2011 14:30:10 |
everywhere it slips they come in handy. those who need front spikes to climb up just have such crampons. that's it.
well, I perceived stezosledka's post differently.
as for this forum, it will end when everyone just nods along. for progress criticism is always welcome, or necessary. my view. that's how we align and gain knowledge, experience.
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| heinz5. 04. 2011 16:08:31 |
Surely there are several people here with a good dose of experience. All agree unanimously that chains shouldn't suffice for hiking in high mountains, or steep slopes, but only real crampons with teeth. These sometimes have less than 12 and some are without front teeth but still proper hill - mountaineering gear, which even the manufacturers of those chains don't claim they are.. Quite the opposite: they warn against users confusing them for mountaineering ones.
I doubt any reputable specialized mountaineering shop offers them.
Claims that they perform well in mountains etc. are thus regardless of any subjective view, experience or feelings unfortunately out of place on this hill - mountaineering portal.
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| skrajnik5. 04. 2011 16:19:47 |
FORUM CONDITIONS: has anyone been to Storžič today 
better I go check myself
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| turbo5. 04. 2011 19:53:23 |
Skrajnik, don't forget the chains 
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| dragica.gnjezda@gmail.com5. 04. 2011 20:14:46 |
since some here talk about some chains, let me clarify, I'm talking about CRAMPONS that have 9 POINTS below, 6 front and 3 back.
sufficient so it doesn't slip - message for those interested.
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| JusAvgustin5. 04. 2011 20:26:53 |
if those are the chain ones then no point continuing, since we obviously don't distinguish basic terms. I heartily advise against this thing for winter ascents. Ah and also, read the first line of the description on the manufacturer's page...
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| peakson5. 04. 2011 20:28:15 |
Ok fine, can admin clean the topic!? Spam on 3 pages! Open trash-talk and go at it there among yourselves or on PM. Topic here is Storžič, unfortunately not seen on the last pages!
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| KristinaG5. 04. 2011 20:30:11 |
Dragica, are you paid for advertising those crampons?
And a comment on this quote:
"...When we were at Kališče, Matej took command saying he knew the path from Kališče to Bašelj well, but we still got lost..."
At the fork of these two paths you already need to be careful during the day and it's easy to miss if not attentive enough. So given that the guys rescued you when it was getting dark, I'd refrain from such a comment in your place and not be so prickly.
As for Juš's so-called arrogance, no point wasting words. Probably lady Dragica still can't get over that crampons debate we had at "Begunjščica". If he was as arrogant as you described, he probably wouldn't have helped those two. And if he posts his mishap that day here on the forum, it's just to warn that mountains are no joke.
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| GregorC5. 04. 2011 20:30:24 |
No panic, Dragica. I think we all know what you're talking about and those are chains. True, it's sufficient as long as it doesn't slip. But on flat and easy terrain. Much better for the hills are classic 4 or 6 point crampons that also have no front points. As long as you don't start getting more serious and begin tackling higher and more demanding terrain. Then you need something more substantial. Otherwise with or without crampons, a safe step further to one and all. LP
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| urbann5. 04. 2011 21:26:14 |
I can't believe there's even a debate about the suitability of crampons in winter conditions for the Storžič ascent. I don't know if besides, say, Raduha (from the hut at Loki) there's any other 2000er in Slovenia that almost doesn't require crampons in winter (don't know the Julians that well). The ladies that afternoon just mildly fu**** up, Juš smartly posted a general warning, so I don't even know what's so controversial here... except the bs debate that developed....
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