Keko - Recent messages

Since we really liked the equipped route Steber + upper variant V-/III 160m in Gradiška tura, which we climbed a while ago, my wife and I decided this time to climb the longest route in Vipava, namely the unequipped Nikolaj route IV/II-III 375m long, located in Podraška tura.
We left the car at the parking lot by Gradiška tura and walked to St. Nicholas church.
The route starts with good III, continues through bushes and a vertical slab already appears in front of me, which is the nicest and hardest part of the route, as it goes along the left edge over the slab, which is Paklenica-compact and sufficiently structured so climbing isn't tough. Follows a part of the route that's quite hikeable and the rope feels best on the back. Difficulty starts increasing gradually and so I reach for the rope again, which is more for psyche though, as everything sticks out like teeth after a molar extraction and is secure, intermediate protection harder to place. Well at least the wife was belayed properly.
Nicer again are the last two pitches, as the rock is compact again and here the wife even leads the last pitch.
At the top phenomenal views far around, in mostly cloudy weather and pleasant temperature well below 20 degrees.
Then along the ridge we continue to the marked path leading from Abram towards Gradiška tura and descend by it to the car.
From car and back to car it took us exactly six hours.

On Sunday my wife and I with a group of via ferrata climbers set off on a trip to the Hohe Tauern in Austria. We arrived by cars to the foot of the gondola and then took the gondola to Lake Kristall Weisssee at 2250 m altitude, which lies at the foot of Granatspitze mountain (3086 m). We had extreme luck with the weather, so we enjoyed phenomenal views far around on surrounding peaks over 3000 m.
Our goal was the Kristall Weisssee via ferrata, which climbs above the glacial lake with difficulty E. Before entering the via ferrata you can descend via cable to the other side of the stream.
The via ferrata runs right above the lake and it quickly became clear to us that it's a very difficult via ferrata, as already C/D difficulty sections reach the difficulty offered by Železna Kapla in its hardest part. The via ferrata has 150 elevation meters and 400 meters of cable. Progress is very slow, as considerable resting on the lanyard is needed, which is an essential aid here, since the cable is loose and there are quite a few overhanging parts on the via ferrata. The hardest part of the via ferrata is at the transition between ladders, where you have to overcome a roof that looks really impressive from below. According to via ferrata climbers who have several E's behind them, this via ferrata is the hardest among all they've climbed so far. Really a wonderful place for easier hiking, beautiful views and exceptional via ferrata that we will remember for a long time.

Hard to explain the difficulty of this via ferrata to someone who has no experience with via ferratas yet. The via ferrata has sort of two key spots and especially the starting part, where you need to be careful due to muddy and often wet rock. Both key parts are relatively short. The first is somewhat overhanging and about two to three meters long. Due to the overhang arms suffer quite a bit. If you use good technique arms don't suffer as much. The second key part is at the beginning of the second part and consists of just two moves. Especially shorter ones sometimes have problems as you need to pull yourself up. Here you can try multiple times, as you stand on fairly comfortable terrain and no danger of a bad fall. Via ferrata rated D/E. Compared to via ferratas of similar difficulty, this one is among the easier for the rating. If not confident enough, best to tackle it with some experienced who can help you out of trouble with a rope. If you're averagely built man with some fitness, you should almost manage it. Don't underestimate it at all as quite a few people got burned in it. My wife and I had no problems in it. True, by then we had some quite harder via ferratas behind us.

Tominškova is quite a bit easier than Mrzla gora, somewhat easier, say, than Kopinškova to Ojstrica. If you've hiked almost all KSA, you have nothing to fear.

At the end of each path description there could be some categories. For example: difficulty, exposure, equipment ...
Next to each category 10 stars (like once under pictures). Mark a star from 1 to 10 according to your own judgment. Average ratings with sufficient participants would give a fairly realistic rating per category. Maybe exclude 10 or 20% of the most deviant ratings to eliminate speculators.
This would add some interest to the forum.

I think these issues have been debated quite a lot already. With three ratings available, it is really hard to define difficulty and it is completely normal that within the same difficulty class there are already quite big differences between the lower and upper limit. There is already a fourth rating "extremely difficult trail", which is mainly reserved for hard via ferratas that have only appeared recently here. Especially with via ferratas you see how outdated and unsuitable our difficulty categorization system is. For all via ferratas here there is only one rating. If Austrian ratings A, B, C... did not appear in descriptions, we would not even know what really awaits us on such a via ferrata.
It would already be time to adapt the categorization to today's conditions and needs or simply officially adopt the Austrian difficulty categorization system, at least for extremely difficult trails - via ferratas.

Well, cables can be found on easy trails too, plenty on harder ones, so that's not really a measure of difficulty.

Every person experiences the difficulty of hiking trails differently. If one person rated the difficulty of all trails, comparison between trails based on rating could be more relevant. But since probably quite a few people gave trail ratings, the difficulty ratings also reflect individuals who perceived those trails differently. A nice example is in alpinism. The one who goes to climb Knez's four will quickly hang if they actually can't climb a six.

If you toughen your hands gradually, you can climb pretty long ferratas even without gloves. So far I've climbed all ferratas without gloves and without blisters. Best feel is without gloves.

Two paths lead to the top of the mountain. One extremely demanding via ferrata and easier secured. Up via ferrata, down easier secured. So we have mountain, via ferrata and easier secured path. So who goes up and down easier secured has link to mountaineering, I who go up via ferrata and down easier have no link to mountaineering.
Really, interesting thinking.

A few years ago I witnessed a girl's fall in the Želazna Kapla via ferrata, on the hardest part. The girl was in the group ahead of us. She was hanging on the safety kit and it was clear her strength was completely gone. Luckily, there were people in the group who knew how to proceed. They tied her to the rope and helped her continue the path, or better said, they almost dragged her forward over the wall, since she was completely exhausted. In such a case, just the rope isn't enough, you also need to master maneuvers, rope technique and rescuing the fallen, just like primoza wrote above. Otherwise, the rescue can be very dangerous even for those trying to help.

On this forum we meet people with very different experiences. From those for whom the path to Šmarna gora is already a challenge to alpinists for whom everything under IV difficulty grade is very easy. Difficulty is a very subjective assessment of the individual and we cannot generalize it at all. Regardless of how many experiences someone has, on this forum one can find very useful information. You need to know how to filter posts and look for posts from such that we will find ourselves in too. If you already look at an individual's profile, you can already figure out where who belongs. I'm not bothered at all by posts say from Dejan Grm although I'm not even half as fast as him. For me it's actually interesting to read them. In reality the posts from tours from no one bother me. But sometimes I'm a bit bothered by the smart remarks of some who don't post anything from their tours but are extremely critical of others' posts. Precisely the posts give life to the forum. As different as people are, so colorful are the posts too. Let's respect diversity and not criticize everything in a row. The forum is not as bad as some want to portray. I think on the contrary it's a very good source of information. You just need to know how to find them and everyone will find what they are looking for.

Why is there no equipment in bivouacs: http://www.planet.si/novice/slovenija/video-kako-ohranjeni-so-planinski-bivaki.html

The bivouac by itself only offers shelter from storms, wind and partial cold. Additional equipment is just luxury, which is welcome. But nobody can demand it as mandatory part of equipment. When an alpinist bivouacs in the middle of winter somewhere in a wall, he would probably feel like in heaven's kingdom in such a bivouac, even if unequipped.

Any self-belay kit they sell in specialist shops is fine. Best to visit a shop or two and try some kits. The one you feel best in is the best for you. Important to get the right size.
Something about using the kit you can read here:

Via ferrata kit is mandatory only on real ferratas where there's no messing around, with us (Gonžarjeva peč, Ferrata to Češka koča and also this new one on Lisco), everywhere else with us it's an individual matter. A few years ago, for example, on the ferrata in Železna Kapla I saw a runner flying over it without protection, which is really quite extreme.

Yesterday my wife and I went via ferrata again after three years. We chose the recently very popular ferrata to the Czech Hut.
When you get to the start of the ferrata itself, it doesn't look too adrenaline-pumping, as it's surrounded by greenery and there's quite a normal amount of dirt on the rock.
This rather tame appearance probably misleads quite a few hikers who tackle this ferrata and quickly realize they can't handle it. Even the hardest part of the ferrata doesn't look anything special, but it requires two moves where most of the body weight is on the arms. This detail is the cause of most failed attempts. There are quite a few hikers with enough stamina, very strong legs, and unfortunately poorly developed arms that aren't capable of making two strong pulls needed in this detail. Whoever has already climbed the hardest routes in our mountains, including Kopiščarjeva on Prisank, is by no means guaranteed to succeed here. Ferratas are a completely different world.
Whoever takes a little care of arm conditioning as well won't have any special problems on this ferrata.
The ferrata offers two harder details that are very short, climbers would call them bouldering. Given the rating it carries, I'd say it's fairly easy. So far I've climbed four ferratas that have an E in their rating and I can say this is the easiest. It's missing longer harder sections that really start squeezing you like a wet rag. That's like the ferrata in Visoke Ture, which my wife and I climbed three years ago: http://www.hribi.net/trenutnerazmere.asp?aut=1&gorovjeid=57&id=4782&stran=1
Also the Gonžarjeva peč ferrata and Železna Kapla are harder than this one, as they have longer harder sections.
Nevertheless, the ferrata to the Czech Hut shouldn't be underestimated as it's a real ferrata. The ferrata offers only natural footholds for the feet, which in the hardest parts aren't exactly abundant, and even those are worn and covered in dirt. Without technical knowledge that greatly facilitates overcoming such ferratas, only strong arms can save you.
If we lack at least one of these two qualities, such ferratas can be very unpleasant experiences.