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| velesa25. 02. 2012 23:39:12 |
Lidija, as soon as I spotted you at the parking lot under Gradiška with a camera in hand, I thought of you. Then I caught up, asked if you're going climbing and wished you luck. I continued alone on the "normal" path. I returned via an unmarked but well-visible trail that leads down into the valley right by the summit. I really expected your description  .
In the valley I met lots of them heading to the wall.
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| pohodni26. 02. 2012 10:31:34 |
Nice weather drew us too yesterday, so the whole family drove to Vipava Valley to see what this Gradiška Trail looks like.
With my son we of course climb the climbing route, the other three family members take the easier path. When we meet again at the top of the climbing part, our daughter also wants to try the hard one. We quickly descend the easy way, then up the climbing route again. Both succeeded excellently.
Although the path is very demanding and quite exposed, it's also excellently secured, lots of natural holds in the rock, not crumbly at all, so no fear of anything breaking off in your hands. I think this trail is great as a training ground for anyone planning to summit Triglav, since if you manage Gradiška, the route from Kredarica to Triglav shouldn't be a problem. Of course excluding the fitness needed for Triglav, which is much, much more.
So we continued the trail to the top of Gradiška and then the same loop as Lidija Jesih back down to the parking.
About the weather and temps, it says it all that we did the whole trail in short sleeves.
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| Kita26. 02. 2012 12:29:28 |
this trail is at least one grade technically more demanding than from Kredarica to Triglav summit, if not then I don't know why they give grades in guidebooks at all....
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| pohodni26. 02. 2012 14:59:47 |
"Kita", what you wrote about technical difficulty may be completely true, but we have to consider that due to numerous Triglav summit visitors the whole path from Kredarica up is pretty worn out and the steps are no longer as stable and safe as they could be, or once were. We can't ignore the number of hikers and consequent frequent dodging when meeting on that path.
Regarding the comparability of just the climbing parts of these two routes, that's my completely subjective opinion not considering the experts.
Best regards.
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| Kita26. 02. 2012 17:04:07 |
regarding the climbing part we could say that Gradiška Trail can already be classified among vias ferratas since from pictures it feels like you're really climbing a bit in places, whereas Triglav is hiking along cables and countless wobbly pegs, the difficulty from Kredarica is rated 2 out of 6. via ferrata on Triglav??? We have very few real full-blooded ferratas here... Otherwise even on salon ferratas people have fallen...
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| Kita26. 02. 2012 21:57:18 |
Accompanying aids, brackets, pegs and all other artificial helps, then I conclude all Slovenian ferratas are salon ones, except Gonžarjeva peč in Vinska gora is the exception, because apart from the cable it has no other salon additions.
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| LidijaJesih27. 02. 2012 05:52:30 |
Velesa, I'm really glad we met, next time we'll know where to go! The day was nice, I wish us many more like this this year.
About the debate below: everyone has their subjective assessment, but what's written sometimes everyone interprets differently, based on experience of course. I think this secured path is demanding, nicely protected, with really nice rock, decently exposed and also in my experience an excellent training for anyone who hasn't tried demanding secured paths yet. On it everyone can find out if it suits them or not, how they are with vertigo and skill. First time of course obligatory with all gear, helmet, self-belay, gloves not amiss. Whoever climbs this trail will technically manage any other here, the rest is just fitness. We have a nice saying (borrowed, yes). Go and see.
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| turbo27. 02. 2012 05:58:32 |
Vias ferratas the western neighbors have and klettersteigs the northern. (what do the eastern have  ) Secured paths, from really easy ones to the hardest, we have lots here. And what's hard for me isn't necessarily for others and vice versa.
But true, every beginner is tough
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| VanSims27. 02. 2012 13:58:26 |
No, Kita, if I understand Primož correctly (based on what he wrote), precisely Gonžarjeva peč IS a salon ferrata, Triglav of course not!
Salon ferratas abroad: Fallbach, Turkenkopf, Lavamund,...
Non-salon ferratas abroad: Via Italiana, Via della Vita, Königsjodler, Dachstein-super ferrata,...
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| Kita27. 02. 2012 22:21:18 |
fallbach, turkenkopf, lavamund... those are low-altitude sports ferratas. The non-salon ones listed below run in high mountains, for example to me the super ferrata originally Der Johann which we reach after climbing the ferrata below it called anna sports type ferrata and falls into your so-called salon ferratas, only Johann takes us to the hut at 2741m... That means it's a high-alpine salon ferrata....
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| Kita27. 02. 2012 22:33:11 |
Konigsjodler is in private ownership like many Austrian ferratas true it runs in high mountains and takes us to 2875m but we can equally classify it among salon ferratas,because it's on the same pattern as most Austrian ferratas...
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| B227. 02. 2012 22:56:44 |
Hello!
Nowhere have I seen any material about "salon" ferratas! This is now a new and made-up term! Various "excuses" also appear in the name of rock composition and similar - it's all daydreaming... Gradiška Tour is a real "ferrata" and also very exposed, whether we admit it or not, which those of us who renovated it (not built!) felt - those who built it, not to speak of! The plaques on Triglav ridge mentioned in comments - all are result of lightning! -and not slips over the wall!!! Gradiška tour is definitely harder than the "ferrata" on Triglav, which isn't one at all! But in Gradiška tour arm strength is needed, which on Triglav isn't since we can stroll "salon-like" on the "slippery" path along pitons and taut cable! Come, equipped with self-belay kit climb the "Gradiška tour" and then head to real ferratas - and you'll realize what is the introduction to climbing secured mountain paths! Don't belittle something us Primorska folk and also (sorry!) Slovenes can be proud of!
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| Kita28. 02. 2012 00:13:21 |
Bravo B2 that's how you talk and it's true what you said.....
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| savinjcan6528. 02. 2012 07:46:23 |
"Salonska ferrata"??????, probably the rock is as hard as that in the real "ferratas", and difficulty is a relative concept, people are different also in abilities. b.r.
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| Zebdi28. 02. 2012 08:36:09 |
But some of you are stubborn, oh boy. primoza nicely explained what he meant by "salonska ferrata". Short approach, compact rock, relatively low risk of falling rocks and possibility of quick retreat in bad weather. So a ferrata you can casually jump on in the afternoon after work. Comparing this ferrata to high mountain ferratas is equally "sensible" as comparing a 7a route in the crag and an VIII route in alpine north face. Climbing difficulty is the same, right?
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| VanSims28. 02. 2012 09:06:23 |
Yes, Zebdi! That's more or less how I imagined 'salonske ferratas'. So what I wrote is approximately right...
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| Bojan_A28. 02. 2012 11:55:21 |
I don't care what you're arguing about. But as a curiosity I can tell you that the composition of the limestone building Triglav range is completely different from the limestone composing Nanos. Limestone found in Julian Alps (and KS-Alps) is Upper Triassic age and belongs to the so-called Dachstein formation. It formed in shallow water environment with occasional mud deposits.
While the limestone building Nanos is Jurassic and Cretaceous age. In origin it's actually a huge fossilized coral reef (paradise for fossil coral and shell lovers), which at its greatest extent stretched from our areas all the way to Greece.
More about this in my book in 2 years.
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| Flora128. 02. 2012 16:22:39 |
We can hardly wait for the book, Bojan! Keep it up!
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| joža x28. 02. 2012 16:35:12 |
I think here the smartest ones are those who have only "ventured" up the easier hills...
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